Thursday, June 30, 2005

Paca questions

Paca has asked me a couple of very different questions recently. I'll post my replies here.

First, he asked for more details on the database design. "What DB backend will they be using, and what sort of front-end. Are these web services of some sort, or are you talking about building something in Access?"

We will be designing both the structure and the interface using an Access-like product called "My SQL". Mike has used it before and recommends it, so that's what we are going with. Web service would be nice, but it probably won't happen. We are going less complicated than that. The interviewers will use pen and paper; once a week or once a month these will be returned to a central office where someone will physically input the data into the database. While I have dreams of creating a PDA interface that can then download via an internet connection to our server, the reality is that 1) that's beyond my ability to code, 2) most of Bangladesh doesn't even have internet access, and 3) they have specifically requested the simpler method.

As to the second question... you asked earlier about my take on the G8 debt cancellation for a few heavily idebted poor countries. Well...

Poverty in the developing world is a very complex issue that nobody really understands. There's been years of attempts to get at the problem, and so far there has been far too many failures and not enough successes. But it is pretty safe to say that there are both external and internal causes of poverty in these countries. External factors include barriers to trade with the West, the draining of money from the local economy by multi-national corporations, and, of course, the huge debt burden's these countries carry. In some cases debt service may consume up to 60 or 70% of a country's annual budget. It's hard to feed your citizens or create investment incentives or even provide basic security when so much of your revenue is already committed to debt service. Also remember that the money servicing the debt is leaving the country... so not only is it not being used for development, it's not benefitting the local country in any way at all. That's where the drive for debt relief comes from... if we can eliminate that money drain, then perhaps those countries can use the money that was going to debt repayment to instead go to development activities.

But just cancelling their debt will not work. The main reason for doubt is because of the internal reasons for poverty... most notably, corruption. If by cancelling the debt these countries then use their newly freed resources to invest in development, then there's no problem. If these countries though start rewarding favorable contracts to friends and family of those in power; building unneeded projects that benefit the wealthy elite of the nation and not the working poor; or even just flat out taking a big chunk of the taxes for themeselves, then the extra money does not help development at all. Remember, these are some of the poorest countries in the world; they didn't get like that by chance. All of them have suffered from severe government corruption at different times in their past. And once corruption is entrenched, it is very, very difficult to remove. Just look at the Philippines - that is one of Asias oldest democracies, rich with natural resources, with strong ties to the West. And yet they lag far behind other SE Asian nations such as Thailand, Singapore, and even Malaysia (not too mention Korea and Hong Kong). Why? Because of the culture of corruption and class entitlement. They are struggling to get through it... but 20 years after the fall of Marcos and we again have a case today where the President is accused of buying the election. Not coincidentally, the Philippines also has the largest external debt of all southeast asian nations (with the possible exception of Indonesia).

All of the countries that the G8 is eliminating debt from are ones that have demonstrated "good governance". That is, they have behaved in a way that the West deems relatively uncorrupt... usually this is just a nice way of saying that they have a relatively open free-market economy which welcomes foreign investors. If their politicians truly are unselfish and looking to develop the country, then cancelling this debt is a good idea. But it could just turn out to be another opportunity for a few wealthy and powerful individuals to add another few million dollars worth of import cars to their collection.

There are other problems, as well. First, cancelling debt means that their credit rating will fall, making it harder for them to get new loans in the future, and the loans they do get will be at a higher rate. Second, the G8 can only cancel their official development aid loans that come from teh government, which is a relatively small portion of the debt these countries carry (most of it is in private bank loans). Third, cancelling debt while the west still maintains huge agriculture subsidies and other barriers to trade means that the country will still be unable to find an export market for their goods, guaranteeing continued poverty. I don't have the data, but many people believe that the single best thing the West could do to help these countries is to simply cease their agriculture subsidies. Of course that would never fly in the U.S. farm belt... but the subsides we and the Europeans give to our farmers keep food prices artificially low, making it virtually impossible for poor countries to compete.

Like I said, it's complex. Cancelling debt is a nice gesture, but it will not, by itself, do much to eliminate the poverty in these countries.

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9 Comments:

At 2:01 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh, sweet weeping Buddha, please, please use Postgres (instead of MySQL) while there is still a change to save your sanity. I promise you'll thank me later. It's free, talks to everything MySQL does, and is actually an ACID-compliant relational database. Thank you for your support.

 
At 6:33 PM, Blogger pacatrue said...

Thanks for answering, llama.

I have no opinion on MySQL. It is always the first thing mentioned when people are looking for an affordable DB, being free and all, but I have never worked with it. I was mostly curious, because I periodically think about designing some techie stuff, so I was wondering what I could quiz you on if it turned out you were, say, a Macromedia Flash guru.

Very good primer for me on debt relief. Couple questions as always. 1) Are the governments designated as having "good governance" truly good and relatively corruption free, or do they just do what the US or the G8 wants? 2) It was interesting about the export and farm subsidies stuff. I was wondering if the market for these agricultural products has to be foreign markets. Is there any way for them to develop a reasonable domestic market, or at least, say a regional one? So, maybe due to subsidies, they cannot compete ship products to Germany, but how about to East Africa? It is obvious there is more money in other places, but it seems if they could build stronger local markets, then they would be less at the whim ultimately of foreign governments.

I don't know any of this stuff obviously. You always hear about the export markets as the reason for 3rd world country growth - mostly in East Asia in the last 60 years, but at the same time, the reason that that Chinese computer company whose name I have forgotten was able to take over IBM's PC corp recently was because it had become huge selling PCs in China and Asia, not elsewhere....

 
At 10:58 PM, Blogger Llama said...

Thanks for the tip, Jackel, I'll look into it.

The reason China is able to grow large companies using only its domestic market is the same reason the US became an economic powerhouse... the domestic market is huge - large enough to provide adequate demand to make use of economies of scale savings. India is the same way... and you see lots of homegrown Indian companies starting to emerge into the global marketplace.

The same logic applies to food production. In order to reap the benefits of hybrid crops and farm machinery, you have to have a large enough market to sell to that you can make up the cost of the capital expenditure. That's another reason the US is able to make food cheaply... with huge thousand acre farms, three or four guys driving some big tractor can pretty much manage the whole thing. But each one of those tractors cost many tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands. Doesn't make much sense to buy one if your a Peruvian peasant just farming an acre in your back yard.

To get around the problem of small domestic markets, countries have to look overseas. There has been several attempts to form "South-South" trading blocks, in which countries of reasonably similar levels of development agree to free trade. This expands their effective market while excluding the big players such as the US and Europe. But usually the big players don't like being excluded. A big reason for CAFTA is that the US wants to get into some regional South-South trading blocks that have been setup down there. Japan is trying to muscle into ASEAN. The fact is that governments act for their own well-being first, even if, in the long-term, it may be better for them to just butt out.

 
At 2:44 PM, Blogger pacatrue said...

You da bomb.

I guess the time has just past for significant small-scale ventures. You gotta go with huge capital outlays to do anything, and then that means you need huge revenues to make ends meet. I was hoping that there could be a way for small scale agriculture and cottage industries to, if not build a base of modern day wealth, at least build a base of people who are fed and clothed without outside aid/influence/interference. But I don't really know if the peasant economies of 100 years ago would be considered morally acceptable anymore. After all, in those economies, there was no health care and people died at 35.

 
At 8:37 PM, Blogger pacatrue said...

Just saying hello to sr and crew, who should be getting to Bangkok about now. Hope you all have a tremendous visit!

 
At 11:25 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"And once corruption is entrenched, it is very, very difficult to remove." Dudebra, that explains why our current governor is surrounded by a lot of people who appear identical to people that used to hang with EWE. I was beginning to think that some sort of cloning was involved.

I also hope that "good governance" means good governance, but I am fairly certain it means what it always means: "Give me what I want, I'll erase the debt, I could care less what happens to the people of your country, and for that matter, mine." Within reason of course; there still have to be enough people in your country to mine the metals or gems, and there still have to be enough people in my country to be jealous of all my cash.

Most of the people in power don't care about "the people." Persons that care about "the people" don't win elections, they get sidetracked by helping "the people" somewhere along the way.

Don't mind me, I'm still hopped up on ribs, bbq sauce, and the American Dream.

 
At 11:05 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

So, do you think that the current track the U.S. is on, owing more and more money to outside entities while its own population cannot keep up with internal inflation to maintain standard of living, will result in us falling from power and becoming a third world entity in the next few centuries? Just curious.

 
At 12:55 PM, Blogger pacatrue said...

Oooh, that's scary. Kristy has me pegged as female. And I just posted a blog on another web site that one can still be masculine if you didn't know about car repair. Dang, looks like I was wrong. I am in fact a girl. Well, at least I will be cuter.

 
At 9:03 PM, Blogger Llama said...

Sammy, you raise a good question... and I wrote an entire response and then deleted it because it's the kind of question that deserves some factual evidence to support the answer. I'll try to gather some and post a full blog on my views of the US economy and its place in the world.

In short, though, I'm not optimistic.

 

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